I've been trying to find the community rules related to copyright of my images. Where can I find this?
In particular, I want to know what the RSPB can do with any images that I upload to the forums or anywhere else on the site.
As my images are also occasionally uploaded by an RSPB staff member to a reserve blog, I want to know the copyright and use status of those images, too.
My wildlife sounds and images at http://www.jerryhoare.net
LOL, if i sell my picture to Getty I own the copyright, unless of course I also sell my rights to the copyright.. I give Getty the right to use it either for a once off use or for multiple use. I still own the copyright I have just given them the right to use my picture. By uploading to this site Jerry still owns the copyright but he has given permission for the RSPB to use his picture as they seem fit. The copyright hasn't altered at all. All copyright means when you upload to a mutually exclusive site such as this is you have given the RSPB to continue to use it as they seem fit - you have made it a royalty free image for use by the RSPB.
Forget permission to use, thats just being polite. If they want to use your picture they can because it's been uploaded here. Unless you have a mutually exclusive use for a once off on the blog then you have given the rights to your picture away even though you are still the legal copyright holder.
www.andrewa.zenfolio.com
Plover said: LOL, if i sell my picture to Getty I own the copyright, unless of course I also sell my rights to the copyright.. I give Getty the right to use it either for a once off use or for multiple use. I still own the copyright I have just given them the right to use my picture. By uploading to this site Jerry still owns the copyright but he has given permission for the RSPB to use his picture as they seem fit. The copyright hasn't altered at all. All copyright means when you upload to a mutually exclusive site such as this is you have given the RSPB to continue to use it as they seem fit - you have made it a royalty free image for use by the RSPB. Forget permission to use, thats just being polite. If they want to use your picture they can because it's been uploaded here. Unless you have a mutually exclusive use for a once off on the blog then you have given the rights to your picture away even though you are still the legal copyright holder.
I'm not disputing any of that in any way Plover.
All that I am saying is that I don't believe that the T's & C's are worded the way they are so that the RSPB (or other forums/websites that are similar to this, that use similar T's & C's) can actively exploit images and other content that is uploaded for their own purposes - they are worded this way to protect the RSPB from the possibility of future copyright claims (which is very sensible IMO).Preferences
�
Roy, I have no doubt of the admirable intentions of the RSPB but post pictures here and the T&C's are quite clear, the RSPB can use those pictures and make money from them and have no obligation to pay you a penny but do have to credit the picture to you the CR holder. The only sticking point is Jerry's original issue of it the RSPB asked to use a picture of his. Then it's less clear unless Jerry clearly stated how the picture could be used how many times and for what purpose and more importantly if it could be re-licensed for future use by the RSPB.
Unknown said: As an aside, Roy, I don't think the Ts&Cs say that "the RSPB would expect to try and seek permission from a poster if they knowingly wish to use an image that has been uploaded elsewhere". What they say is that they would seek permission if they want to use CR material uploaded to the Community elsewhere. An image that has been uploaded is copyrighted material Jerry! Photographs and artwork are protected by copyright in the same way as any other material, and the copyright is maintained by the photographer when images are uploaded (just with permission given for the image to be used). Therefore, if permission will be sought (where reasonable) before copyrighted material is used elsewhere, that includes the use of photographs.[/quote] Having re-read this, Roy, I think I originally mis-read you, and so simply re-stated what you said! My wildlife sounds and images at http://www.jerryhoare.net
As an aside, Roy, I don't think the Ts&Cs say that "the RSPB would expect to try and seek permission from a poster if they knowingly wish to use an image that has been uploaded elsewhere". What they say is that they would seek permission if they want to use CR material uploaded to the Community elsewhere.
An image that has been uploaded is copyrighted material Jerry! Photographs and artwork are protected by copyright in the same way as any other material, and the copyright is maintained by the photographer when images are uploaded (just with permission given for the image to be used). Therefore, if permission will be sought (where reasonable) before copyrighted material is used elsewhere, that includes the use of photographs.[/quote]
Having re-read this, Roy, I think I originally mis-read you, and so simply re-stated what you said!
Plover said: ... is Jerry's original issue of it the RSPB asked to use a picture of his. Then it's less clear unless Jerry clearly stated how the picture could be used how many times and for what purpose and more importantly if it could be re-licensed for future use by the RSPB.
... is Jerry's original issue of it the RSPB asked to use a picture of his. Then it's less clear unless Jerry clearly stated how the picture could be used how many times and for what purpose and more importantly if it could be re-licensed for future use by the RSPB.
jerryh said: ... is Jerry's original issue of it the RSPB asked to use a picture of his. Then it's less clear unless Jerry clearly stated how the picture could be used how many times and for what purpose and more importantly if it could be re-licensed for future use by the RSPB.
[/quote]
Any images that are not uploaded to this website by the copyright holder will not be covered by the T's & C's stated here, and as such it is up to the copyright holder and the RSPB staff using the images to make sure that they are both clear about exactly what permission has been granted before photos are used (and especially before any re-use). Perhaps the RSPB head office needs to make sure that their staff are aware of this in order to protect themselves from potential copyright claims for photos that have been given to staff via email etc. in the same way that they are protected by the T's & C's on this website? It would be a shame to complicate things so much that photos end up not being used on reserve blogs, but if a photo is to be retained for potential future use it shouldn't be too difficult to get an email giving permission for this which can then be retained.
With regards to this forum, I wouldn't want people to be put off from uploading photos because they think that the RSPB will be retaining their images for free use and even to make money from them - I am certain that the reality is that that won't be happening. The fact that the T's & C's mean that the RSPB can use images does not in any way imply that there is any intention for them to do so.
Unknown said: ... is Jerry's original issue of it the RSPB asked to use a picture of his. Then it's less clear unless Jerry clearly stated how the picture could be used how many times and for what purpose and more importantly if it could be re-licensed for future use by the RSPB.
I agree with all this.
T&Cs are commonly worded in the manner described to allow the forum owner to modify the image. That modification is normal on a site - it may be automatically resized for example to display correctly on the page (which is why you may see a slightly different sized pic when you click on it mid-conversation and it opens in a new tab).
The whole thing gets rather grey if you insert a link to the image on Flickr of course, because you haven't "uploaded" it to RSPB in that instance. I pondered the copyright issue some time back before I uploaded any images on here (I don't use Facebook for precisely the manner in which their T&C's cheerfully claim so many rights over your pics), but decided that, in the extreme case that the RSPB DID want to use my image in some way for their gain, I wouldn't object anyway - I support them in a number of other ways, that would just be one more.
___
Find me on Flickr / All about your camera - The Getting off Auto Index
I give up. Upload what you wish with total impunity. I do because my pics are of no commercial value.
Plover said: ...I do because my pics are of no commercial value.
...I do because my pics are of no commercial value.
I don't know about that. Your butterflies are good - the Small Copper in particular.
As for uploading or submitting potentially commercial images, I think it's still possible to share them for others to enjoy and appreciate on here without too high a risk of losing out on their commercial potential.
Just from the discussion here today, I have decided to continue to submit images, but I may well make them a little smaller than previously, and I will probably have at least an informal discussion with my friendly local RSPB staff.
Thanks for your input.