Far too much bird ringing

To be fair though, the Dunnock trend has been identified principally via the Common Birds Census and latterly the Breeding Birds Survey, which don't involve ringing.

aiki said:

To be fair though, the Dunnock trend has been identified principally via the Common Birds Census and latterly the Breeding Birds Survey, which don't involve ringing.

CBC and BBS are invaluable in identifying the trends. What they don't say is why the change is happening, and this is where information gleaned from ringing comes handy. For instance, if we know from ringing that the survival rate of any or all age groups has changed, or if we know from the Nest Record Scheme that the nest failure rate has changed, we will be able to identify the reason behind the observed changes and do something about it.

Yes, was going to mention the Nest Record Scheme too but for some reason I didn't... the point I wanted to make was that we have a lot of tools at our disposal for studying and monitoring wild birds as well as ringing.

I think that all ringers are responsible! and that as far as it been somewhat a competion to see who rings the most I find this quite defamatory.

As far as copius ringing of resident species been overkill, what can this tell us what we don't already know.

What do we know. What studies, papers and journals have you read?

I know the Dunnock  has seen a 25-50% decline since the 80's and is on the BOUC amber list and is a priority species. The cause of the decline remains unknown.

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Right, I'll be careful here, as my last post was edited (which actually highlights my concerns about what this forum has become recently) and I really don't wish that to happen again; although, anyone who has contributed to the thread has received an email from the forum showing the original text before it was deleted, so I'm not sure what good this editing does.....

B, I don't see how you can claim that ALL bird ringers in the UK are responsible, you cant possibly know that.

I would agree that the vast majority are, but I am CERTAIN that, as in all lines of work/hobby's, there are some bad apples, and an element of competitiveness must, and surely does exist.

Next, I haven't read any papers, but I have eyes and ears, and I do know that in my particular neck of the wood I see just as many, if not more Dunnocks, than I ever did; strangely, this leads me to believe that Dunnocks are doing fine, at least here.

A friend of mine is a Ringer, he specialises in Barn Owls for the county, but he also has a little patch in which he rings small birds regularly.

Now, he's a lovely fella, and this Spring he and I were talking.

He was lamenting the lack of Stonechats caught in the net recently, and that this must mean that these birds are in decline.

I then told him that in an area just a couple of  miles west of there, I had seen far more Stonechats than I had EVER in my twenty or so years of birding.

They seemed to be ubiquitous, singing from every Gorse bush/fencepost.

This continued throughout the Summer, first and then second broods were reared, and even yesterday, whilst out with the camera, I saw a fair old amount.

But, my friend saw/caught very few over the Spring, Summer and Autumn, and would now say, if asked, that (here at least) Stonechats have declined this year.

This to me shows that, if a net set up at point 'A' shows that less examples of a certain species were caught and ringed than in previous years in the same place, that doesn't  automatically mean that the population of said species is in decline.

You would need a mist net set up over the whole county to say that for SURE.

It could be that the ringing area has a new pair of Sparrowhawks, or, there are more cats around than previously; or, that a certain food source just isn't available anymore for what ever reason.

I believe eyes and ears are FAR more indicative and accurate for population trends in common species, than vast amounts of ringing ever will be.

Jimmy.

Hi Moderators think we have all had our views aired on here and much as I dislike locking seeing as some comments taken off and some edited it may keep contributors on the forum if this thread locked,certainly I had not expected such reaction when I first commented and have not personally felt insulted or hurt but think if we are not careful we could lose a couple of valuable contributors. 

If this comment upsets anyone I apologize in advance but think it in the best interests of the forum and I do realise I have contributed as much as most people.  

 I had not expected such reaction when I first commented and have not personally felt insulted or hurt but think if we are not careful we could lose a couple of valuable contributors. 

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Too late for me Sooty, having just read through my email  inbox, and being a little shocked by what I found there,  I'm out of here.

Jimmy.