Moving to Mirrorless

Well, I've finally done it, and ordered a new Canon R5.

Some of you may have seen my comments about looking into new cameras and gear in another post, A couple of days by the River Deben in Suffolk, and my apologies to Dave for the unintended hijack so I've set up a new thread to keep folks updated.

To continue from my comments, as many of you will be aware, I've been grounded by my falling apart body, but i've nothing but praise for the nurses, consultants, doctors and anyone else involved it working hard to resolve the situation.

We've all heard the old saying, the devil makes work for idle hands, well, include computer and mouse into that, and I've been researching into mirrorless cameras, which is the future, whether we like it or not.

Me, I'm intrigued and like the concept, but not the costs.....

Why the Canon R5?

Well, first and foremost, my son said go for it!

Some of you may be aware his partner walked out on him eighteen months ago, which almost rendered him homeless. While we would happily have taken him back, after a chat with my wife, his mother, I gave him a large chunk of my savings and agreed to be guarantor for his mortgage. I never gave any repayment terms, but he did ask how much, and has transferred some of the money back to me, enough to cover the R5.

I've been using Canon cameras for many decades, and I feel they are on a par with Nikon and the other big brand names, the only problem is, if you change to another brand, then you need to change all your lenses and other associated kit as well.

My research started with the cost of upgrading and also, many camera manufacturers also offer conversion kits, or adapters, so you can use your existing lenses on the new breed of cameras.

Also, my research shown that could I use my existing lenses, the cable and wireless remotes would work, so will the Speedlite flashgun. The only extra items required are the lens mount adaptor, and the memory cards, which are still the existing SD Card, or, the faster and more capable CF Express card, whereas  the 5D4 will use a Compact Flash card.

Also, the battery pack for the R5 is the same is the 5D4, which I understand is the same as the 5D3.

This appealed.

However, the cost was still going to be steep.

My local postie, who we had for 20+ years, a very friendly chap, I never realised he did wedding photography, and offered to show me his cameras, which are Nikon, and how he managed to make the change to mirrorless.

We both agreed, Nikon, Canon or any of the other big names, you can't really go wrong.

After a very interesting three hours and numerous cuppas, and some time handling his cameras in the garden, and to play safe, I sat down to use them rather than stand and risk falling or dropping them, I was nicely impressed with what I saw.

There are some trade offs and caveats with electronic view vs live view, but I'm not one to be negative. Obstacles are there to be beaten, not beat you.

The one big downside, if it is a downside, is video. The final quality is good, however, when panning a moving subject, there is a noticeable lag. But then I don't do much video, and to be honest, my current 5D4 has some lag, because that in video mode uses the large TTF screen and not the optical viewer, which is live view.

I said obstacles are to be beaten, not beat you.

The video quality is superb, and a bigger plus, the electronic viewfinder shows the same as the large TTF screen, but the big bonus with the EVF, is you block out all the viewing intrusions that using a TTF screen came impose.

There will be more to this no doubt, as I start a new journey mirrorless, and I will be happy to share.

However, it is costly, and to make things more costly than desired, my nearest emporium haven't stock of the R5, so I've had to order from elsewhere, and not being able to go far, that means no trade in of my 5D4, which if I'm honest, I am reluctant to part with.

The new camera is on order, and should be with me in the next couple of days, all I need  is for my leg to sort itself out.

  • Some excellent results Mike - good to see such positive outcomes just from sitting in the garden & playing with settings. The AF's capabilities are remarkable - and I too have discovered unexpected benefits. In my case it was using a Sigma 1.4x on the Sigma 180mm f/2.8 macro. The aperture is not an issue, but Sigma themselves say adding the extender means AF will not operate under 0.67m - and that is exactly the case with the 5D4. However the R5 somehow manages to persuade the Sigma lens to focus right down to minimum with the 1.4x, giving an AF, stabilised 250mm macro lens!

    ___

    Find me on Flickr / All about your camera - The Getting off Auto Index

  • Hi Mike,
    As for shutter noise have you tried the electronic shutter, it should make it silent or virtually so in constant auto focus mode. There are some issues using an electronic shutter for very fast moving objects, like an insects wing beating, which can produce a curved wing from the rolling shutter or jello effect. The mechanical shutter reduces this but you lose access to the super fast shutter speeds. With shutter speeds up t0 1/30000 sec or more you would have thought you could freeze anything but the Jello effect is cased by the sensor scanning from top to bottom and that scan can take up to 1/60 sec with each line of the sensor reading for what ever the shutter speed is. The link below helps with the explanation.

    www.dpreview.com/.../electronic-shutter-rolling-shutter-and-flash-what-you-need-to-know
    Good luck with your trials,
    Trevor
  • Hi Mike,

    I don't know if you have thought of this but with mirrorless cameras the EVF lets you see the result of any adjustments you make, e.g. EV adjustment, live in the viewfinder before you commit to a shot.

    In the two pictures below I used 1/500 sec at f 6.3, ISO 200 and -1 2/3 stops of EV and electronic shutter to reduce camera shake. I just thumbed the EV wheel until it looked OK in the viewfinder.

    The first picture is a jpeg straight of the camera, just cropped and the second is a RAW file after going through DXO Photolab 5.

    Hopefully this helps if you haven't found or thought of this for yourself.Grinning

    Best Wishes,

    Trevor

  • Hi Mike,
    Looks like the trials are going well, probably just making you keener than ever to get out and about again.
    Trevor
  • Unknown said:
    Some excellent results Mike - good to see such positive outcomes just from sitting in the garden & playing with settings. The AF's capabilities are remarkable - and I too have discovered unexpected benefits. In my case it was using a Sigma 1.4x on the Sigma 180mm f/2.8 macro. The aperture is not an issue, but Sigma themselves say adding the extender means AF will not operate under 0.67m - and that is exactly the case with the 5D4. However the R5 somehow manages to persuade the Sigma lens to focus right down to minimum with the 1.4x, giving an AF, stabilised 250mm macro lens!

    Thank you.

    I never had any doubts to the cameras capabilities, more my capabilities. If any photos didn't turn out and I had no obvious reason(s) why, then I'd look at what I was doing first, then the rest will fall into place, rather than blame the camera.

    What really did surprise me, and excitedly so as it happened was when I started to use the 2x convertor. I never expected for one second for the AF to kick in, so that really is a big bonus, even better, the clarity.

    I think I need a serious camera kit sort out now the R5 is more than doing me proud.

  • TJS said:
    Hi Mike,


    As for shutter noise have you tried the electronic shutter, it should make it silent or virtually so in constant auto focus mode. There are some issues using an electronic shutter for very fast moving objects, like an insects wing beating, which can produce a curved wing from the rolling shutter or jello effect. The mechanical shutter reduces this but you lose access to the super fast shutter speeds. With shutter speeds up t0 1/30000 sec or more you would have thought you could freeze anything but the Jello effect is cased by the sensor scanning from top to bottom and that scan can take up to 1/60 sec with each line of the sensor reading for what ever the shutter speed is. The link below helps with the explanation.

    www.dpreview.com/.../electronic-shutter-rolling-shutter-and-flash-what-you-need-to-know
    Good luck with your trials,
    Trevor

    Not as yet, I've still a lot to explore, and it is turning out to be a fantastic journey of exploration, and lots more yet to unfold.

    I know from my early investigations, something was said about shutter settings and frame rates etc, and as you probably realise, it was part of a lot of useful info, and too much at once, so thank you for the link, I shall have a good read, and as you probably realise, I will be playing around a lot more to get the best I can from the camera.

  • TJS said:

    Hi Mike,

    I don't know if you have thought of this but with mirrorless cameras the EVF lets you see the result of any adjustments you make, e.g. EV adjustment, live in the viewfinder before you commit to a shot.

    Many thanks for the info Trevor.

    While I was aware of the feature, there will be others who are not, so as always, a valuable input.

    I will at some point give it a try, not only in the EVF, but also on the TTF screen, which reflects the EVF in either preview or shooting mode.

    Mirrorless is definitely a big leap forward in so many ways, and more becoming apparent, not by the day, but by the hour.

  • TJS said:
    Hi Mike,


    Looks like the trials are going well, probably just making you keener than ever to get out and about again.
    Trevor

    It certainly is, and thank goodness I'm retired, because work would only get in the way.   Fearful

    So will home chores once I'm able to do them again, if only I could find a way of dodging those chores.....    Thinking

    The camera is certainly a box of fantastic and fascinating surprises, if that is a way to describe it.

  • OK, another successful time with the camera, was a trip to Baddesley Clinton on Sunday 7th August. Not just from the photographic perspective but also trying to push my walking back to where it was.

    Anyway, back to mirrorless, though I only used the R5 and the 100-400 lens, the results were more than pleasing, and added to that, I was fearful of using the camera at full pace on record shooting.

    But, I ineeded to try it and get the feel for it, but before then, the bees and butterflies provided perfect subjects along with the perfect weather. Later on, when I went to where the swallow nest is, that was the time to try the record shooting on all settings.

    Even at the fastest frame rate, my fears of filling the CF Express card with lots of shots were alaid,. Sensible holding of the shutter button for short burst durations like a swallow flying to and from a nest and out almost immediately, do not require that much of a prolonged press of the shutter,  therefore filling the card up will not really happen.

    Unfortunately, standing long enough to capture proper flight action at the moment is a good few steps too far. But it'll come.

    Everything else was pretty much what I expected. You can see the full photo compliment in: "Baddesley Clinton, Sunday 7th August" along with some lens and photo cropping detail.

    https://community.rspb.org.uk/wildlife/f/all-creatures/281060/baddesley-clinton-sunday-7th-august

  • I recently had a visit to Wakefield with the good lady- main points of interest were Piece Hall in Wakefield and Shibden Hall (location of TVs Gentleman Jack) and Halifax Minster and I carried out some experiments which probably apply to most of the mirrorless modern cameras.

    You know what it's like walking round a stately home trying to take pictures relatively quickly so as not to hold people up too much, but because you're indoors but with strange lighting from windows etc you know that its a struggle to try and work out correct exposures - I decided to try hand held HDR and let the camera do all of the work and have to say I was more than happy with the majority of the results